off to on grid

I dont think that is the case.  like all renewable energy it depends on the demand or load and the specific resources available (sun and budget). 

i am not sure why it is worth while to spend money and inefficiencies on batteries when the ultimate goal is grid tie.  figure out what the goal is.  If it is fun with a small off grid system, then great, but that should not be confused with the grid tie system goal as just about all of the components will not transfer over.

i would suggest knowing your energy usage first.  second i would set a goal for potential energy usage and possible energy production.  third implement the plan for conservation and efficiency.  fourth, site analysis for renewables.  fifth renewable energy system design, purchase, installation.

if the goal is ultimately grid tie, then i see no reason to bother with setting up a small off grid system first.  dont get me wrong, small off grid systems when installed safely are lots of fun, and a great learning experience.  that learning experience does not necessarily have anything to do with the goal of the grid tie system.  you can get into a grid tie system for less than $5k.


my question to the forum is what is "worth while" to tie to the grid?  for me the mere completion of the project no matter the wattage is walking the talk and setting the example for friends and neighbors.  any code compliant safe system to me is worth while.  what do you think?


thanks for writing in.

james
altE staff

Having batteries to back up your heating system and a few essentials can be very handy.
Regards,
Dennis

My 2 cents worth,
     I got into this with the motive of getting off the grid.
At first investigation I was told to call the power company and ask about net metering. My power company ask me to explain what net metering was, I did explain. They said very snubbally No. Like I was stupid for even asking, I told them to get ready cause it is coming. Then I was advise to check codes for my solar water heater. Code department told me that they have never been asked that question, and did not know. Poof I was done with them.
 I now have solar water heater, 430 watts pv, and a 800 watt windmill. All bought out of state. Drove to pick up panels and collector. Got 1500 watt pure-sine inverter, 2 charge controllers, 1 Windmill by shopping around on-line. I would not reccomend doing it this way. Codes and all. But I like a challenge and adventure. I am shooting for maybe 10 years to be totally off grid and its not looking good. But who knows, Gotta have hope. And just maybe. Alt-e store has been very Helpful and one of the best suppliers I have dealt with. Good luck As we trudge the road to happy destiny.

Actually not a great idea.  Grid tie panels are different.  You really need to make the decision right up front.  For example if you want to run 12v DC stuff like lights and fans and small appliances, and have some inverters for AC stuff, you'll be buying panels that put out 17-18v to charge 12v batteries.  On the other hand, if you want to do grid tie you'll be buying panels that put out 23v or so. 

I found this out when I got all excited about 200watt panels I wanted for my 12v system.  If the watts are that high, they are probably for grid-tie systems.  The biggest I could find (and I'd love to hear from an Alt-E person if this has changed) is 125-130watts for a 12v system. 

I've wrestled with this same question and have concluded that if you want to do grid tie, just plan on taking out a big loan and do it all at once.  Make sure you do your math carefully on how long your payback will be in relation to utility savings. 

If you want to grow a small system into a bigger one like I do, you can do it a few bucks at a time.  I'm attacking my ranch in modules and don't feel a need to even have the whole place on one single unified system.  I will stay on the grid, but I don't want my system grid-tied cuz our grid power goes down 3-4x a year. 

You can buy more panels as you can afford them, but if you're growing a battery bank try to complete it in a few months so you don't end up with batteries of different ages.  Also, a huge charge controller like a Xantrex c-60 is not that much more than smaller 30 amp controller, so start with the biggest charge controller you can imagine ever needing. 

As your system grows beyond that, you can have entirely different charge controllers and battery banks to do different duties in the home. 

That's my perspective on the piece-meal plan.  If you want a unified solar system that runs everything, get a loan and hire someone smart.

SS
 

Well,
I am glad I was able to spark a little conversation.

My original goal and my long term goal has changed since I have joined the ranks of solar power users.
Because I am in an old apartment in Houston I have huge electric bills. The apt. complex has no interest in putting in an efficient a/c unit. I spend $315 for 2kw/h per month for a 1000 sq. feet.  Doller per sq. foot I am getting really ripped off.  At first I just wanted to drive my own window a/c unit with a solar panel hidden on my back porch since a window unit couldn't be any worse then the a/c unit that I have from the apt complex.

But since then I have started to look at buying my first home.  It will need to be a run down foreclosure needing help. 

My thoughts based on what everyone here has said are now to skip the batteries at the apartment and go to a small grid tie system and some how bundle it into a renovation of the foreclosure.  This might be possible with the Enphase Micro-Inverter which I am told can be used to start a "small" grid system and grow with more panels over time.

I think a good goal would be 1.5 kw/h per month for a 1500 square foot home with 50/50 grid and tie in electric.

Maybe the question should be put out to the community is not how many panels or on/off grid system but how many kw is need per square foot of living space.

More thoughts please.

Tony

Thanks,
Update to my units:
2040 KWh May to Oct.
1080 Kwh Nov to Apr.

1016 Sq. foot apt.

14.6 cents/KW on a 1 year contract which ends in August.

Shopping for a home $60 square foot not more than 1500 sq/ft. to remodel/renovate which would include the solar system upgrades.

Right about the first $5000 of improvements.
Looking at a 203K FHA Loan which will allow for upgrades.

Most homes in Houston have single pan windows and min. insulation.

A local radio home improvement show said that a tankless water heater is so over priced that it would take 15 years for a standard payback.

A friend has a SolCool DC a/c system with 4 dedicated panels.

Almost need a check list.
- a/c
- hot water
- windows
- insulation/radiant barriers
- fridge/freezor
- entertainment/computer/lights

So, to the community, best suggestions for $5000 in home improvements before buying a PV system.