System requirements

7 Posts
Apr 22, 2009 08:53 pm
System requirements

I have an outdoor large item vending machine on it's
 own trailer. It uses 110v ac,20 amp.I would like to convert to solar. Could I use a inverter, deep cycle 12 vdc battery or batteries and a roof mount panel to charge the battery? Also a friend mentioned there may be the need to connect to an 8' grounding rod reason being if someone was standing on wet ground or in a puddle while using the machine
 
Apr 23, 2009 05:41 am
Re: System requirements

110 X 20 = 2200 watts this is probably the size circuit it requires but more importantly, you will need to know kWh's or kilo watt hours that the vending machine uses. What is the longest period of time it is expected to run?

As for ground fault protection. Its always a good idea to have public safety in mind. GFCI receptacles can be used on some inverters. Read inverter specifications.

 
351 Posts
Apr 24, 2009 11:42 am
Re: System requirements

That machine is probably already ground fault protected. Check your owners manual or the electrical schematic for an internal GFCI.

A 20amp draw at 115V would be about 200 amps on the 12V side.  I would start thinking 24 or 48 VDC.

This is not going to be 1-2 batteries and a single panel.  You are most likely looking at somewhere between 6-12 KWH a day. Just ball parking the lower number you are looking at maybe 1400lbs worth of batteries and something above 1.5kw worth of panels.
You are probably looking at a $15K starting price and it could easily double that.
 
14 Posts
Apr 25, 2009 07:02 am
Re: System requirements

110 X 20 = 2200 watts this is probably the size circuit it requires but more importantly, you will need to know kWh's or kilo watt hours that the vending machine uses. What is the longest period of time it is expected to run?


I'd agree with Thomas....if that is the breaker size used, that doesn't mean it's the amount of power used.  Best thing you could do is buy a Kil-a-watt meter, plug your machine into it and take a reading of the actual power consumption over a few days/weeks to see what it uses.....then you can make some informed decisions about going alternate.
 
351 Posts
Apr 25, 2009 12:58 pm
Re: System requirements

The fact that the Mfg put a 20 amp plug on it means that that he wants it on a 20 amp dedicated circuit. It generally indicates that the machine will draw better than 15 amps for a period long enough to trip a 15amp breaker. Depending on how much and how long it exceeds the 15 amps, it could possibly damage the kill-a-watt. They are only rated at 15 amps.
Even with a Watts-up, which can handle 20 amps, you need to get cords rated for 20 amps, not the 15amp cords that it generally comes with.
Using adapters to sandwich a 15 amp device between a 20 amp source and a 20 amp load is risky business. If you do it, you had better hang around and watch it. Feel the cords for excessive heat, etc. Do not leave it unattended.
 
18 Posts
Apr 27, 2009 11:16 pm
Re: System requirements

I'm not sure I saw it in the description, but exactly what kind of vending machine?. . .  Is this a Coke-cola refrigerated machine, or just dry goods?. . .
 
7 Posts
Sep 21, 2009 05:33 pm
Re: System requirements

Sorry for the delayed response

The machine vends prebundled firewood. It uses an electric motor (6.7 amps) that turns a screw drive to push the bundle out into a catch bin. The motor runs approx 15 sec's when activated by the bill validator.The bill validator draws very little and runs all the time.3 exterior low watt lights dusk to dawn. I was hoping to use a 2500 or 3000 watt power inverter with a deep cycle battery and a solar battery charger for now.Please advise  Thanks  John     
 
99 Posts
Sep 25, 2009 08:53 pm
Re: System requirements

I suspect the breaker size is due to the start-up amperage spike that the motor creates and does not in any way reflect the actual continuous power usage of the machine.  I would calculate based on how many times it actually dispenses the firewood. 

Let's say that it does 100 per day.  Let's round it up to 7 amps that should more than accommodate the bill validator and any other ancillary loads.  100 x 7 amps x 110 volts x .004167 hours = 320.83 watt-hours.  Let's add the lights -- 3 x 13 watts x 12 hours = 468 watt-hours.  Together, that's 788.83 watt-hours.  Assuming 4 hours of full sunlight, you would want a solar panel rated at about 200 watts (cost is approx. $600-$800).  Add a 50 to 100 amp-hour sealed gel/agm (to prevent off-gassing and maintenance) battery for another $150 and you can keep your machine working for several days without sunlight.  Add a 60 Amp Xantrex or Outback MPPT charge controller for $550 and a Xantrex Prowatt 1kW continuous (2kW/25A surge) inverter for $460, plus some wire, and your total cost comes to around $1,800 - $2,000. 

Since I was conservative in sizing this (and especially if you go with a 210 or 220 watt solar panel), you'll likely have many times where you have far more solar than you can store.  Thus, I'd recommend hooking up an electric resistance snow melt loop in front of your vending machine connected to your charge controller as a diversion load.  It will turn on whenever you have sunlight and your battery is full.  This way, your customers will likely deal with less snow and ice when getting their firewood and none of your solar will go to waste.
 

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